Some moral dilemmas

09-21-2007, 11:19 AM

The Overcrowded Lifeboat

In 1842, a ship struck an iceberg and more than 30 survivors were crowded into a lifeboat intended to hold 7. As a storm threatened, it became obvious that the lifeboat would have to be lightened if anyone were to survive. The captain reasoned that the right thing to do in this situation was to force some individuals to go over the side and drown. Such an action, he reasoned, was not unjust to those thrown overboard, for they would have drowned anyway. If he did nothing, however, he would be responsible for the deaths of those whom he could have saved. Some people opposed the captain's decision. They claimed that if nothing were done and everyone died as a result, no one would be responsible for these deaths. On the other hand, if the captain attempted to save some, he could do so only by killing others and their deaths would be his responsibility; this would be worse than doing nothing and letting all die. The captain rejected this reasoning. Since the only possibility for rescue required great efforts of rowing, the captain decided that the weakest would have to be sacrificed. In this situation it would be absurd, he thought, to decide by drawing lots who should be thrown overboard. As it turned out, after days of hard rowing, the survivors were rescued and the captain was tried for his action. If you had been on the jury, how would you have decided?

A Father's Agonizing Choice

You are an inmate in a concentration camp. A sadistic guard is about to hang your son who tried to escape and wants you to pull the chair from underneath him. He says that if you don't he will not only kill your son but some other innocent inmate as well. You don't have any doubt that he means what he says. What should you do?

Sophie's Choice

In the novel Sophie's Choice, by William Styron (Vintage Books, 1976 -- the 1982 movie starred Meryl Streep & Kevin Kline), a Polish woman, Sophie Zawistowska, is arrested by the Nazis and sent to the Auschwitz death camp. On arrival, she is "honored" for not being a Jew by being allowed a choice: One of her children will be spared the gas chamber if she chooses which one. In an agony of indecision, as both children are being taken away, she suddenly does choose. They can take her daughter, who is younger and smaller. Sophie hopes that her older and stronger son will be better able to survive, but she loses track of him and never does learn of his fate. Did she do the right thing? Years later, haunted by the guilt of having chosen between her children, Sophie commits suicide. Should she have felt guilty?

The Fat Man and the Impending Doom

A fat man leading a group of people out of a cave on a coast is stuck in the mouth of that cave. In a short time high tide will be upon them, and unless he is unstuck, they will all be drowned except the fat man, whose head is out of the cave. [But, fortunately, or unfortunately, someone has with him a stick of dynamite.] There seems no way to get the fat man loose without using that dynamite, which will inevitably kill him; but if they do not use it everyone will drown. What should they do?

What if, instead of a fat man, it was a pregnant woman, who the others had urged to go first?

**Opunaya** · 09-21-2007, 11:24 AM

Hmm...interesting...so, you want us to make our choices? I'll have to think for a bit.

acutelyaware · 09-21-2007, 01:21 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Girl

The Overcrowded Lifeboat

In 1842, a ship struck an iceberg and more than 30 survivors were crowded into a lifeboat intended to hold 7. As a storm threatened, it became obvious that the lifeboat would have to be lightened if anyone were to survive. The captain reasoned that the right thing to do in this situation was to force some individuals to go over the side and drown. Such an action, he reasoned, was not unjust to those thrown overboard, for they would have drowned anyway. If he did nothing, however, he would be responsible for the deaths of those whom he could have saved. Some people opposed the captain's decision. They claimed that if nothing were done and everyone died as a result, no one would be responsible for these deaths. On the other hand, if the captain attempted to save some, he could do so only by killing others and their deaths would be his responsibility; this would be worse than doing nothing and letting all die. The captain rejected this reasoning. Since the only possibility for rescue required great efforts of rowing, the captain decided that the weakest would have to be sacrificed. In this situation it would be absurd, he thought, to decide by drawing lots who should be thrown overboard. As it turned out, after days of hard rowing, the survivors were rescued and the captain was tried for his action. If you had been on the jury, how would you have decided?

i would charge him for accidental homicide

A Father's Agonizing Choice

You are an inmate in a concentration camp. A sadistic guard is about to hang your son who tried to escape and wants you to pull the chair from underneath him. He says that if you don't he will not only kill your son but some other innocent inmate as well. You don't have any doubt that he means what he says. What should you do?

ethically, the father should save the others lives as well, it was his sons choice to try and escape. but i would still save my son

Sophie's Choice

In the novel Sophie's Choice, by William Styron (Vintage Books, 1976 -- the 1982 movie starred Meryl Streep & Kevin Kline), a Polish woman, Sophie Zawistowska, is arrested by the Nazis and sent to the Auschwitz death camp. On arrival, she is "honored" for not being a Jew by being allowed a choice: One of her children will be spared the gas chamber if she chooses which one. In an agony of indecision, as both children are being taken away, she suddenly does choose. They can take her daughter, who is younger and smaller. Sophie hopes that her older and stronger son will be better able to survive, but she loses track of him and never does learn of his fate. Did she do the right thing? Years later, haunted by the guilt of having chosen between her children, Sophie commits suicide. Should she have felt guilty?

no, she shouldn't feel guilty, she did only what she knew at the moment. but she will feel guilty anyway i'm sure

The Fat Man and the Impending Doom

A fat man leading a group of people out of a cave on a coast is stuck in the mouth of that cave. In a short time high tide will be upon them, and unless he is unstuck, they will all be drowned except the fat man, whose head is out of the cave. [But, fortunately, or unfortunately, someone has with him a stick of dynamite.] There seems no way to get the fat man loose without using that dynamite, which will inevitably kill him; but if they do not use it everyone will drown. What should they do?

the fat man should be blown up-it's his fault he was blown up

What if, instead of a fat man, it was a pregnant woman, who the others had urged to go first?

pregnant woman is a different story...idk

**Opunaya** · 09-21-2007, 01:45 PM

^ Depends how much of a bitch she was and who was in the group of people...

For someone I care about alot, I could easily sacrifice someone else.

**Brother of Yeshua** · 09-21-2007, 02:09 PM

For the fat man in the cave one, I'd say use the dynamite, because there is a risk no matter what, and if the man is partway out of the cave, he may be severely injured, but he could still have a potential for survival, and a greater chance than the people trapped in the cave would.

I would hope a pregnant woman would have the sense not to go crawling around in a cave. But if she did, perhaps another argument we could add is this particular genetic line may be from the shallow end of the gene pool

I think all of these just go to show that sometimes there are no win, win, win situations in life, and people have to make sacrifices.

Frankly, if I were the fat man, I would willingly concede to the plan, because of my own argument I just gave (I know I can say that easily not being in the situation, but I truly do believe I would do that).

Along with that, the stipulation that they keep trying to get me out without dynamite until the water is too high to do anything but that.

**Opunaya** · 09-24-2007, 05:33 AM

We all know fat people aren't people anyways...

**SARS-expl0ted** · 09-24-2007, 06:19 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Girl

The Overcrowded Lifeboat

In 1842, a ship struck an iceberg and more than 30 survivors were crowded into a lifeboat intended to hold 7. As a storm threatened, it became obvious that the lifeboat would have to be lightened if anyone were to survive. The captain reasoned that the right thing to do in this situation was to force some individuals to go over the side and drown. Such an action, he reasoned, was not unjust to those thrown overboard, for they would have drowned anyway. If he did nothing, however, he would be responsible for the deaths of those whom he could have saved. Some people opposed the captain's decision. They claimed that if nothing were done and everyone died as a result, no one would be responsible for these deaths. On the other hand, if the captain attempted to save some, he could do so only by killing others and their deaths would be his responsibility; this would be worse than doing nothing and letting all die. The captain rejected this reasoning. Since the only possibility for rescue required great efforts of rowing, the captain decided that the weakest would have to be sacrificed. In this situation it would be absurd, he thought, to decide by drawing lots who should be thrown overboard. As it turned out, after days of hard rowing, the survivors were rescued and the captain was tried for his action. If you had been on the jury, how would you have decided?

A Father's Agonizing Choice

You are an inmate in a concentration camp. A sadistic guard is about to hang your son who tried to escape and wants you to pull the chair from underneath him. He says that if you don't he will not only kill your son but some other innocent inmate as well. You don't have any doubt that he means what he says. What should you do?

Sophie's Choice

In the novel Sophie's Choice, by William Styron (Vintage Books, 1976 -- the 1982 movie starred Meryl Streep & Kevin Kline), a Polish woman, Sophie Zawistowska, is arrested by the Nazis and sent to the Auschwitz death camp. On arrival, she is "honored" for not being a Jew by being allowed a choice: One of her children will be spared the gas chamber if she chooses which one. In an agony of indecision, as both children are being taken away, she suddenly does choose. They can take her daughter, who is younger and smaller. Sophie hopes that her older and stronger son will be better able to survive, but she loses track of him and never does learn of his fate. Did she do the right thing? Years later, haunted by the guilt of having chosen between her children, Sophie commits suicide. Should she have felt guilty?

The Fat Man and the Impending Doom

A fat man leading a group of people out of a cave on a coast is stuck in the mouth of that cave. In a short time high tide will be upon them, and unless he is unstuck, they will all be drowned except the fat man, whose head is out of the cave. [But, fortunately, or unfortunately, someone has with him a stick of dynamite.] There seems no way to get the fat man loose without using that dynamite, which will inevitably kill him; but if they do not use it everyone will drown. What should they do?

What if, instead of a fat man, it was a pregnant woman, who the others had urged to go first?

Wow. I want to know where you go these.
This stuff brings out so many options and honestly, I wouldn't know how to handle any of them unless it came down to that moment.
With the boat thing, I most likely would have done the same thing he did.
I probably could never choose between my children but that is just something I can say easily. If it came down to it, I honestly don't know what I would do.

I don't know. All of these forced me to think more about certain situations.

**Opunaya** · 09-24-2007, 06:26 AM

^ Honestly, I would've tried to see if they would take me instead of the kids.

**Kelley** · 09-24-2007, 10:45 AM

I would have to say "one to many"
Sacrificing one person (in the case of a pregnant woman, two) to save many.

That's how I would decide.

**SARS-expl0ted** · 09-24-2007, 12:41 PM

Yea, that is how I would go at it too and Opu I didn't mean that I wouldn't sacrifice myself for my children, I was just saying if it came down to where I had to choose one or the other, I wouldn't be able to do it.