What Defines Greatness?

**Brother of Yeshua** · #1 (**permalink**) 06-01-2008, 09:42 PM

A lot of people in history have been called great by someone or another.

Gandhi
Hitler
Washington
Moses
Karl Marx
Socrates
Elvis
Susan B Anthony
Winston Churchill
Rosa Parks
Einstein
Beethoven
Jesus
John Lennon
Chomsky
Steinbeck
Gloria Steinam

To name a few.....

What makes a person great? Many of these people did great things (for good or for evil....but lets not start debating what that means here), but are they great people?

Who are some people who inspire you? What qualities is it that have you define their greatness? What makes a person not just capable of great things, but capable of great humanity?

Integrity has to be #1 for me as to what makes a great human being, followed very closely by respect for all people as equally human as you, and good stewardship of resources. If people lived by these 3 principles, I believe the world would be a much more wonderful place.

However, I will say there is something about every one of those people I listed that I think is great. There is greatness to all people, but I would say that true greatness of humanity comes from the three principles listed above.

Not to say there isn't more to it, but I talk too much as it is.

Stossel · 06-01-2008, 09:56 PM

Godly luck.

You know what I'm talking about.

Ol' Patty · 06-01-2008, 10:32 PM

Compassion, understanding, intelligence and passion for knowledge are the foremost on my list of what determines a persons greatness. And of course integrity as you mentioned. Any other quality is pretty much moot without it.

As a society, I think ones ability to bring about change on a large scale determines greatness. Regardless of the change.

eDgE oF iNsAnItY · 06-01-2008, 10:55 PM

That's an easy question to answer!

If you want to know the definition of greatness, I'll let you in on a secret: I am the definition of Greatness!

**Ginevra** · 06-01-2008, 11:02 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by eDgE oF iNsAnItY

That's an easy question to answer!

If you want to know the definition of greatness, I'll let you in on a secret: I am the definition of Greatness!

So, people who are on the edge of insanity? Lol.

I agree that the one thing all of the people on that list have done is cause a large scale change. At least that's how people notice and they get recognized as great.

**Brother of Yeshua** · 06-01-2008, 11:36 PM

But did all the people on the list set out to do such things?

Intentions are everything. I think Hitler was one of the greatest oraters of all time. I don't consider him a great person.

I disagree that level of outreach determines greatness, but you are correct in that is how greatness is noticed.

Did Rosa Parks set out to be an icon? Or did she stand up for what she believed in?

I think we can each be great in our own lives. The myth is that popularity somehow makes you greater.

Look at the way celebrities are fawned over when they donate 1% of their annual income to charity, or spend 2 days picking up garbage at a photo op for some natural disaster or something. Meanwhile real people are making real sacrifice to help out others in need, and go exceedingly unnoticed.

Why can someone who can hit 500 balls really far make over one hundred times as much as people who are rehabilitating people through social service fields? What does that say about the values people hold? Yet I bet you more people would identify a picture of a professional athlete as a great person before they thought of someone like a volunteer firefighter or a brilliant elementary school teacher or a loving parent.

Thank you Ginerva for your comments because this was the deeper issue I was grasping at when I posted the quandry.

Ol' Patty · 06-02-2008, 12:15 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Brother of Yeshua

But did all the people on the list set out to do such things?

Intentions are everything. I think Hitler was one of the greatest oraters of all time. I don't consider him a great person.

I don't think that is necessarily true. "The road to Hell is paved with good intentions." What about people that believe they can bring peace through war? Prosperity through oppression? Hitler may have believed he was making the world a better place. Understanding and knowledge are important in backing up your intentions. If you have good intentions yet are misguided, you can make quite a mess of things...

Quote:

Originally Posted by Brother of Yeshua

I disagree that level of outreach determines greatness, but you are correct in that is how greatness is noticed.

I agree, that isn't how I meant it.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Brother of Yeshua

Did Rosa Parks set out to be an icon? Or did she stand up for what she believed in?

I think we can each be great in our own lives. The myth is that popularity somehow makes you greater.

Look at the way celebrities are fawned over when they donate 1% of their annual income to charity, or spend 2 days picking up garbage at a photo op for some natural disaster or something. Meanwhile real people are making real sacrifice to help out others in need, and go exceedingly unnoticed.

Why can someone who can hit 500 balls really far make over one hundred times as much as people who are rehabilitating people through social service fields? What does that say about the values people hold? Yet I bet you more people would identify a picture of a professional athlete as a great person before they thought of someone like a volunteer firefighter or a brilliant elementary school teacher or a loving parent.

I agree with you 100% here. Ultimately, it isn't the action that brings value but the value that brings action. Many great people definitely do not receive recognition. We live in an immoral society. The reason for the professional athlete vs. volunteer firefighter greatness comparison is that people can relate more with the athlete. It's a part of many peoples lives. Same with celebrities. How many people in this world can relate to the volunteer firefighter or the brilliant elementary school teacher or the loving parent? A small minority sadly. How can you recognize what you never see?

I definitely agree with you that we can be great in our own lives. It's astonishing, the power we possess.

**Ristaron** · 06-02-2008, 01:11 AM

Greatness defines people who have gone above and beyond the norm. Whatever the motivation, if you make noise you will get recognized and lauded by some group or another.

Even many people who aren't famous/infamous are great. In our every day lives we appreciate people on a scale that applies to our single lives. Greatness isn't defined by popularity, but rather by integrity and success. Hitler had integrity; he stuck by his racist bastard principles and was a great racist bastard.

Motivation to be great is a quality in almost all of us. If not seeking to be recognized as great by others, it's at least usually for ourselves. I'm perfectly content if nobody has expectations of me, I know what I'm great at.

**Brother of Yeshua** · 06-02-2008, 01:29 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ol' Patty

I don't think that is necessarily true. "The road to Hell is paved with good intentions." What about people that believe they can bring peace through war? Prosperity through oppression? Hitler may have believed he was making the world a better place. Understanding and knowledge are important in backing up your intentions. If you have good intentions yet are misguided, you can make quite a mess of things...

Absolutely. I should not have said "everything" that's not what I meant

More accurately, MOTIVATIONS of people are what need to be examined, because what truly motivates us shows our true intentions.

Case in point, my close friend, while not what I would call a great human being, is still my friend, and like a brother to me. Recently, we were groomsmen in a wedding together. The morning before, we were supposed to help our friend, the groom, set up the outdoor wedding. He asked us to be there at 9am. My friend decided to sleep til 1130 and then call and ask if there was still food left to eat before coming over.

Food, not friendship, was the motivation to get him moving. He showed up and helped and the groom thanked him for it, but neither the groom nor maintaining a relationship of goodfaith was my friend's motivation.

Sorry for the side story. Anyway, Hitler probably did have good intentions. Personally, I think Hitler was kind of nuts and exploited by the people financing him and have some understanding for the guy, despite the horrendous things he did. However, his motivations were very much to gain power, prestige, dominance, and control over other human beings, thus violating my "big 3" i mentioned.

This isn't really an argument to prove anything, just expounding my thoughts. This is something that I've been mulling about for a while.

Rist, I agree with the not caring I know what I'm great at thing you said, but it makes me think about something else.

Is there such a thing as seeking too much greatness? Lets assume that the greatness is "true greatness" whatever that means to anyone who wants to talk about this. Can we bite off more than we can chew, so to speak? Or are we required to face more than we can handle (or at least more than we think we can handle in the moment) to achieve greatness?

I hope I'm not rambling.

**Opunaya** · 06-02-2008, 07:46 AM

Determination can be something that defines greatness.