Quote:
Originally Posted by RazielRedel
I think that anyone, especially someone who calls themselves a Christian, who is doing good out an attempt to "get into heaven" really has a fundamentally flawed understanding of how salvation works, and more importantly the character of God. The idea isn't do good so that God will reward you. Anyone who has read the bible thoroughly will see that that is not the way he works. Half of the Psalms are about asking why the wicked prosper and the good suffer. There really is nothing someone can do to earn a place in heaven.
The idea is that God punished Jesus for the evil you do in this life, and because of that you are cleared. There isn't any reason to keep you out of heaven because from a legal standpoint you are pure. The reason we do good is not so we can earn some divine favor either in this life or in what comes next, but because we love the one who payed for our debt. It's not a "I've got to repay Jesus for dying for me," and it's not a "I've got to be nice to this person or God will beat me,". What it's actually suppose to be is hard to explain. It's a very humble but very secure asking what God would have you do. It's understanding that you can't do anything on your own, but that God can use you to do something good.
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If Christians got to the heart of the matter, doing good has nothing to do with your "reward" but everything to do with serving God's justice on earth.
Now, that's led to a lot of crazy things over the years, but lets not get into that (at least not yet).
There are quite a few parables and sayings of Jesus that modern Christianity doesn't like to talk about.
The most blatant is Luke 16:1-9 (The parable of the dishonest manager). Read that and try and fit that into modern Christian thought and dogma.
Christians also like to forget the parts about "loving your enemies" and "doing good to those who harm you" and if someone tries to steal your staff "offer them your cloak as well."
The larger idea is that we are to see God within all, treating them as we would treat God, and more importantly, how we expect God to treat us.
Start talking about the parable of the sheep and the goats, or some great quotes involving lines such as "with the same measure you judge is the same measure you will be judged by" or "pull out the 2 by 4 in your own eye before worrying about the splinter in another's" or "love the sinner (person) hate the sin(action)" and watch the protestants quake in their pews.
Not to mention "the love of money is the root of all evil" which wasn't said by Jesus, but isn't any less true (it was either Paul or John....I think....).
It's an idea of equality, fairness, and justice that drives the principles that SHOULD be guiding Christianity.
Instead, they show you snuff films, then tells you Jesus did that for you, so you better love him! (sometimes adding "or else you'll burn burn burn!" for emphasis).
Then, salvation has become "say you love Jesus, cry/wave your hands around/speak in tongues/fall over/something to prove it, get dunked in some water (or sprinkled), sometimes eat some bread and drink some wine/juice, and badabing, badaboom, you're in!"
Considering the vast wealth of words attributed to Jesus regarding the above issues, and the stark lack of words about anything I just typed immediately above, you start to see the root causes of what's going on.
Americanized Christianity, like most Americanized things, lacks any sense of personal responsibility or development, and provides a nice simple package, and all your answers can be found in one spot!
I hope this isn't too off topic, but I feel these are the issues in the Christian church that result in the mindset of "Ooo! Ooo! If I do good things God will love me better than other people!" It adopts the same dominant mindset of our current culture, and overshadows all of the radically passive views espoused by the man they all claim to be so in love with. No wonder they're such assholes to non-Christians.
Ultimately though, these views are used to justify and support (whether consciously or subconsciously) the egotism of the individuals as a way to meet needs for self-love by demeaning others (I'm better than you because of x, y, and z).
Atheists fall into the trap of intellectual elitism (Look how much smarter I am than all these other dumb-asses who believe in something they call God) or how much better they are (Look at all these religions fighting, I'm so much more peaceful than those douchenozzles) or just to brag about all the great things they think they've done to their atheist friends.
However, at the same time, if Christianity focused on equality, fairness, and justice, I think most anyone would be interested in what they had to say, including Atheists.
Regardless, simply saying your religious affiliation has anything to do with your personal motivations is just more group think and the world doesn't need that.
This guy seems to have genuine motivations, but that doesn't mean every atheist in the world does too.